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A bunch of maps Suggestion

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ttt_borders - I really think this is a great map. It has a great open feeling, but still enclosed in parts. It feels like a great, exciting map to play as T, but as inno it still has some entertainment especially with the way the T tester works and the weird areas around the maps. Back in the day, borders was our default map when the server crashed which leaves a bit of a bad taste in people's mouth but the fact was even when the server crashed nobody left because of borders, because people liked borders.

 

ttt_equilibre - was one we had later on, I think it was a decent map that's worth trying again, i don't recall it being that open because you can be in the houses and there's some angles you can't hit people at

 

ttt_minecraftcity_v4 - I've only played this in CSGO TTT but I think it's a good map from my playtime there, it's worth trying

 

ttt_clue_se - i think the major issue wwas that c4 was strong here but i think it's still worth adding back, not every map needs to be PERFECTLY balanced. Clue can suck with >20 people but it still has corridors to make it OK

 

de_dolls - foz vouches and I respect his opinion highly, seems fun as someone who hasn't played it

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ttt_minecraft_b5 is fine - I can't remember if we had it back in the day but it's incredibly commonly played and we wanted to avoid having too many minecraft maps, which we already have several of. If people want it we can add it - I'm just wary of the server turning into 24/7 minecraft.

 

Borders has quite a few missing texture/model errors even with CSS being mounted. The 'SGFix' version has completely broken shadows (missing textures so the entire map is covered in checkerboards) and models you can walk through as it wasn't made properly. I'm especially wary of adding it as it encourages the kind of toxic behaviour that led to the death of the original SG TTT server in the form of blocking doors with props as well as frequent RDM with the many explosive barrels in the common area. I understand that some players are nostalgic for it, but this can alienate new players. It's also just not a very good map - the 'underground' is thousands of hammer units away, completely breaking radar/DNA scanners. There's nothing of interest aside from the area around the traitor tester, leaving everyone to clump up there every single round.

 

Clue is already on the server.

 

Forest is okay; we debated adding it but it's a bit boring - it's just a small loop with very few branching routes/indoor areas. I wouldn't be opposed to this one but I personally think there are much better maps out there.

 

Minecraftcity is ok - kind of the same thoughts about it as minecraft_b5 above, though I think the former is more interesting. This one is a bit small and not particularly special in my opinion.

 

Equilibre is missing some textures found commonly across the map and it was removed back in the day as it isn't very fun for innocents. The entire map is covered in deadly water that bodies are instantly thrown in, preventing any from being identified. 

 

Foundation was rejected back in the day - it's pretty small and wide open, leaving traitors with limited options. There are also way too many explosive barrels which is just going to lead to frequent RDM.

 

Dolls - we tended to reject rats style maps back in the day - they're very big and open (by design) which leaves scouting as the main strategy, which can get a bit dull for innocents and lead to frequent RDM. We added ttt_alstoybarn to the server which has the same kind of theme but with a more interesting layout and some TTT features.

 

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The feedback on these maps is highly appreciated, so thanks for making this thread. I'll try to respond to each one individually as best I can, and expand on anything that Elf hasn't already brought up. Note that some maps simply aren't there because we wanted to remain conservative to start off with, and ensure we mostly had standout maps upon launching the server. Of course these calls were made based off just mine and Elfbarf's opinion at the time, which is why getting feedback now from TTT regulars is something we really wanted, as we're here to make the server for everyone. With that being said, some maps I'd unfortunately have to veto due to them not being conducive to all that great gameplay. I'll elaborate on this further below.

 

ttt_minecraft_b5 - A fine map. Can be added without issue granted enough people want it, but like Elf already said we didn't want to add too many minecraft maps as we have already replaced 3 classic maps with their Minecraft counterparts; they also run and play a lot better than their originals (special thanks to Vader and Marshall for these).

 

ttt_borders - A very nostalgic map as it was the original SG server's default map, and so whenever the server would crash (spoiler: it was a lot) this map would be played. Unfortunately looking at it through an unbiased lense it really just isn't a very good map. Elf has already gone over the technical issues the map suffers from as well as the gameplay elements, but I'll expand a bit. The map really only has one main area which isn't all that big, and ends up being where the majority of people just stand around waiting for the traitors to do something. This boredom in the past was usually offset by people playing "loosely", meaning prop RDMing and explosive barrels. This is something we massively wanted to avoid as it is what emptied servers in the past. People would die within the first minute of the round (innocents and traitors alike) to someone bringing an explosive barrel into the middle of a crowded group, where it was only a matter of time before someone decided to shoot it for 'fun' and pretty much ruin the entire round. Borders is unfortunately a hard no.

 

ttt_Clue_se - Already on the server in the form of an updated 2017 map which fixed some technical issues and added a bit more visual flair to some areas.

 

ttt_forest - An alright map. It was actually something I wanted to add out of nostalgia but when testing we realised how limited it actually was. Like Elf already stated it's just a big loop with no real branching paths which makes for limited/deathmatchy gameplay. I wouldn't be too opposed to adding it if the demand is truly there, as I feel it would be okay on lower pops, but anything higher than that and the flaws would start to show.

 

ttt_minecraftcity_v4 - My thoughts are pretty much what Elfbarf already stated.

 

ttt_equilibre - Technical issues aside, it makes life very easy for traitors with there being inaccessible water all around. Being able to dispose of unidentified bodies so easily just breaks the game mode and things become a mess very quickly. Body disposal is typically done through limited or risky means, such as the flare gun (a traitor weapon that costs a credit and still leaves scorch marks to at least show that something happened), or through the magneto stick by hiding bodies in traitor only areas. Having it be accomplished so easily just puts innocents on higher alert than necessary and it ends up becoming an RDM fest due to the increased paranoia. The detective can admittedly purchase binoculars to offset this slightly, but as they are often prime targets and their credits are already very limited, it just feels like too many bandaids are needed to make an otherwise poorly made map somewhat playable.

 

ttt_foundation_a1 - See Elfbarf's reasoning.

 

de_dolls - Like Elf said, large rats style maps like these just end up in scouts being the only real effective way for traitors to accomplish anything which makes the gameplay a bit too one-dimensional, as so many other methods of murder will simply get you spotted. Gameplay tends to devolve more into a deathmatch style as a result.

 

That covers it for now. Feel free to respond and give further feedback, but I hope our posts helped shed some light on why some things didn't make the cut or were outright rejected completely.

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Just a quick update on these requests:

 

ttt_minecraft_b5 - I'll go ahead and add this one later - it's a classic at this point.

ttt_borders - added as ttt_borders_exp (thanks foz!)

ttt_clue - already on the server

ttt_forest - still indifferent about this one, I think it's kind of boring. If someone wants it enough to make a dedicated thread we can try adding it

ttt_minecraftcity_b4 - going to leave this one off for now unless there's a strong desire for it - it's a bit small and open, and I think we have some better maps that are similar size/theme already

ttt_equilibre - leaving this one off, it just has too many problems

ttt_foundation - leaving this one off, it's just kind of bad all around

de_dolls - leaving this one off as well - alstoybarn has a similar concept and I think it's a much better map overall

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